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super smash bros ultimate world of light hard mode without spirits - IS IT POSSIBLE? (spoilers)

PalutenaPalutena Posts: 504Member ✭✭✭✭✭
why did i make this? (why not)

there are SPOILERS in this thread - dont read if you havent beaten the game!

or do i'm not a cop

so i beat the adventure mode normally then i wondered - whats the hardest this experience can be made?

so i tried making a new file, hard mode, and never using any spirits, ever (not counting using them in the overworld to remove obstacles) everyone dies except kirby (again) and so it begins

first spirit is that metal mario, no problems, then you keep going and save the first of 73 fighters, mario
from there there's a choice of 3 characters, marth sheik and villager - i went sheik for some reason (i went marth on my first playthrough so i guess it makes sense)

then i already encounter my first nightmare battle - mike. three opponents against you, with a lot of items that the opponents can very easily grab. after an hour of attempts, a lucky bomb appeared that killed the main target, ending the battle

i continued to free spirits and gain some skill spheres, but the skills werent very good. at one point i saw a trapped fighter with a spirit in its way, and i was met with many marios and severe wind - with no spirit to counter this wind, recovery was near-impossible and the items didnt make it better. but after a long long time i finally pulled through and saved... jigglypuff. wow
i later got the strong wind resist skill which reduced the impact of windstorms from now on

eventually i saved the first fighter that would be very important - lucario. lucario has an aura mechanic that makes him 2.5 times as strong at very high damage which was frequently reached because a single hit would often deal 40 damage or so to me. he also has a very good final smash. as i continued my journey i saved even more spirits and fighters including another very important fighter



dk has one extremely powerful tool - cargo throw. he can grab opponents, go towards the edge, and throw them to the blast zone. especially useful in stamina battles. even the infamous pauline battle was no match for dk. with dk i reached the lava castle, and found giga bowser. i used lucario for this fight because of his aura, and in the end (after almost two hours) i knocked down giga bowser, while at 488% damage. the first of 3 bosses is gone and galeem's shield is weakened. i also saved peach, who will be important later

i then made my way to the base, but this spirit blocked my way. defeat dr mario and EIGHT snakes. many bombs and explosions everywhere, near impossible to dodge them all. eventually i just gave up and went to the temple of light where i went through everything without too much trouble - simon belmont had a power level of 9000 but it didnt seem like it - he sd'd after i hit him once

then i went to the right side of the map going through many other challenges and saving other characters. one interesting battle was the camilla spirit - a poison cloud constantly does damage, so you usually end up at over 300 damage. it took me a while. i then made my way to rathalos. he was quite troublesome but eventually i learned his attack patterns and destroyed him with many bowser dropkicks. by then i had many more skill orbs and so i could get air attack up and landing lag down

then i returned to that troublesome fight, but with my super strong throw and extra jump, along with fire/explosion resist, it was no problem for dk. i saved some more stuff, got to galleom and after way more time than it should have taken, he fell to bowser's dropkicks. i initially used fox, but his reflector didnt work very reliably, by this time i had sunk 22 hours into the run. and now, the shield protecting galeem IS GONE! so i made my way up to galeem

but what about the fighters i hadnt saved?

saving zss was problematic - giant bowser stood in my way, i tried many strategies, but in the end bowsers greatest enemy... is himself. spamming nairs
little mac required me to go through the power plant - the giant zapperfish was really hard but lucario did the job with double final smash

remember when i said peach was important? well she is
i had enough skill spheres to get double final smash and fast final smash as well as healing boost. one peach fs heals 60 on its own so a double heals 120. with the healing boost that becomes a massive 180 healing - extremely useful in a lot of battles (not stamina battles tho) and with her a lot of obstacles fell such as the nikki miis and the star rod kirbies (why are there kirby clones if he survived the attack?) i went through the street fighter world tour with none other than dk and saved ryu, and with that only one character remained.


this really annoying stamina fight was in my way, even though it was just a two star. the enemies (ganon and charizard with 80hp each) had extreme defence and i tried many, many things - but in the end spamming dedede fsmash did the trick after i footstooled zard to oblivion

with everyone in the light realm saved i beat the master hand with ease, and then destroyed galeem with none other than captain falcon, taking "just" 106% damage. 33 hours in, 42 out of 73 saved. DHARKON TIME

i had a choice of 3 - mysterious dimension, sacred land (zelda) or dracula castle. i initially went for mysterious dimension, but backtracked and went to sacred land instead. it wasnt too problematic, although i wasnt able to save bowser jr or mii brawler at the time. i also unlocked zelda in the process, who was incredibly useful against the ganon boss fight. zelda has lightning kicks which can do massive damage quickly. 40 hours in, 51 out of 73 saved

then i went to the mysterious dimension, nothing got in my way until TABUU. a giant bayonetta in a stamina fight where you sometimes take sudden damage (which can kill you) i found no way to get my damage output high enough, even with all the good skills. eventually when i wanted to get her offstage with dk, she just killed herself instead. time for marx. marx wasnt too bad, not many dangerous attacks at all, and with zelda being able to teleport, he went down. i also encountered regigigas (giant rob stamina battle), and i tried many many different characters and eventually found ness can combo lots of fairs, but that wouldnt work. maybe i had to use palutena or something? i didnt come back for a while

-post was too long, split into two parts-


  • PalutenaPalutena Posts: 504Member ✭✭✭✭✭
    oh the spam filter got the second part of this thing. nice
  • BillaboBillabo Posts: 1,324Moderator, Friendly, Conversationalist Mod
    Oh, shoot. I may have accidentally deleted it from the spam queue. It's not in there.
    Fire Emblem: Fates castle address
  • PalutenaPalutena Posts: 504Member ✭✭✭✭✭
    luckily i had it copypasted to a notepad because i suspected this to happen

    Part 2: DEFEAT. CONTINUE? edition

    lastly, its dracula time. by this point i was amazed i had even got this far, and i had found useful strats. ness's down b can heal a lot of damage. when trying to save dark pit? (or whoever it is) this street fighter fight stood in my way. it was a stamina battle where even one hit was my end. then he killed himself

    then came ALUCARD. the most annoying hostile assist trophy ever, i had to do a lot of damage to take him out. i used ness and eventually, i got simon off the stage and went to DRACULA which was a massive problem. stage 1 was really easy and i could usually do it damageless, providing i didnt get bad rng. stage 2 was horrible, with really unpredictable patterns, but then after a really long time i remembered zelda can REFLECT STUFF. i had to wait for him to use his fire attack a lot, but determination won the battle.

    dharkon is next! he... didn't do too much to hurt my run at all. i had lots of learned skills by now, and zelda just made everything easier. though the clones did give me a few troubles. 50 hours in, 61 saved. the ones i hadnt saved yet in the dark realm were rosalina, incinceroar, lucina, mii brawler, bowser jr, corrin, king k rool and mewtwo

    the final battle started and more hands appeared. the first hands went down, and dark samus and roy were saved. now its time to go right and save more spirits. only mythra stood in my way between me and saving palutena, but i cheesed her with footstools and the peach final smash strat. then after saving palutena, master hand was the next target. he was much more of a threat this time, with many new attacks and more health. despite now being able to reflect AND counter, he gave me some trouble and at one point i even reached 999 damage. at one point i caused some kind of glitch by countering at a certain moment, which made master hand nearly impossible to hit because the game is actually 3d. later on i defeated him, with me now 55 hours in

    next is saving bayonetta but i didnt use her because fuck her. at this point i realised palutena can cheese a lot of stamina battles simply by spamming nair over and over again (like lunala) - the cpu just can't escape it. crazy hand was next and he was also pretty nasty, but like master hand, he went down after enough tries. after crazy hand i backtracked.

    remember that regigigas fight i mentioned earlier? well it turns out palutena was the answer after all

    down throw
    down throw
    repeat until dead

    with that i was able to save mewtwo then trevor got in my way - THE RETURN OF ALUCARD. but lucky black hole lasers did the trick and now king k rool finally joined the roster

    i also dealt with some other fights and saved everyone but lucina and rosalina. the first was blocked by a giant metal stamina battle ridley, the second by three mega mans with zap floor. i have yet to find a strat for those two

    then i went back to the final battle, and madame butterfly appeared. constant poison damage, stamina battle. guess what? nair spam again, and i win with still half my health left. then only claus stood in my way. and he took over an HOUR to beat. after defeating the first lucas (easy) another lucas appeared but metal so hes very resistant. lucas's recovery is also super good, so edgeguarding was super super hard. but with all my determination he finally went down. the master hand mob smash was free

    and now the final bosses appear. super galeem, super dharkon and the true ending. i decided that i will go for both bad endings before getting the true ending which means defeating both bosses

    and this is giving me a massive pain. some attacks are impossible to dodge without a teleport move, instantly ruling out all but three characters - mewtwo, palutena and zelda
    three times i got dharkon to very low health (less than 10% of the health bar) but i just didn't do it - the tentacles were too strong

    so now here i am
    71 hours in
    71 out of 73 fighters saved
    only the final boss remains

    can i do it? can i prove the impossible to be possible? can i find a strat to save the last 2 fighters? lets find out
  • PalutenaPalutena Posts: 504Member ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 2018
    ok so
    i was doing the dharkon fight and was so close with just a few more hits left
    and it started charging an attack

    and then

    the attack killed me

    with dharkon down to its last bit of health

    the health bar was LITERALLY empty (yes, there wasn't a pixel of it left)


    edit: this is what i am talking about

  • PalutenaPalutena Posts: 504Member ✭✭✭✭✭

    after many more tries, i finally managed to take down dharkon which leads to the first of two "bad" endings
    i ended up finding that using palutena counter on some attacks can deal MASSIVE DAMAGE so i made use of that quite a bit
    the funny thing is on my successful run i decided to myself "okay i just decided that this will be the one that wins it" it got a bit uncertain when i reached 255% damage when it still had 1/3 health but i got lucky

    next is galeem which does seem cheesable - one of his attacks causes him to shoot lots of fireballs which can be reflected with palutena/zelda/fox/whoever for massive damage, or absorbed as ness to heal a lot of damage

    i backtracked to clean off a few spirits and ashley has to be by far the worst one yet
    after beating it i was massively disoriented by the control reversing that i couldnt play properly for a while

    apparently some other guys have also attempted this challenge
    someone called mew2king managed to get the true ending (he used pause buffering so doesnt count lmao)
    and another guy called nairo made it to the final level
    he uses the team fox/zelda/palutena which i have all found myself to be good against bosses, i was thinking of using the last two but didn't know about the other one (dk? bowser? captain falcon?)
  • PalutenaPalutena Posts: 504Member ✭✭✭✭✭

    one more update
    i finally managed to take down galeem after some good rng and a few hours, didnt take as long as dharkon. GALEEM IS GONE! EVERYONE IS DEAD AGAIN!

    good thing we can go back in time

    after trying to beat omega ridley spirit for a while, i found the answer isnt spam nair
    the answer is spam up air instead
    and so OMEGA ridley fell and lucina was freed, leaving just rosalina with megaman.exe (not a terrible creepypasta) in my way
    i used the peach cheese there and all 3 mega mans fell and at last rosalina was freed, meaning everyone is here, at last

    then came the remaining spirits
    dr eggman seemed hard but you just cargo throw him and metal sonic offstage
    the charizard for ho oh killed himself
    victini incineroar died after like 4 palutena nairs because he cant recover
    dark matter was interesting, as you could string some nairs together but it doesnt last too long, also the screen goes black every so often. i eventually found you just had to punish
    then theres master giant and i cant even remember how i won there (i think i just cargo threw him away)
    viridi doesnt seem too hard, just a sowrdfighter and cragalanche kirby who likes to spam down b from above (why is that familiar?) until you remember that you only have 55 seconds until GOOD RIDDANCE HUMAN SCUM THE WORLDS BETTER OFF WITHOUT YOU and you lose
    on one attempt viridi was falling to her death as the timer was running down
    did i do it?
    but i got there in the end

    then came EMPEROR BULBLAX or whatever he's called
    hes a giant king k rool who doesnt flinch at all with 160HP
    i tried many strats then i eventually tried to get a final smash as peach without dying
    after perfect shielding to reflect some cannonballs back at him i eventually got the final smash and healed all my damage
    i even took some damage on purpose to fill my smash gauge and then ate a peach to heal
    but of course the king charges up his final smash and theres just no way to deal with it but to take the hit
    and i did
    and won
    in the attempts it took to take him down i pulled 2 bombs and 1 mr saturn from the ground
    so after a total of 95 hours, 612 spaces are cleared out of 615
    one of the last 3 is obviously the finale but the other two are dr wily and geno

    with geno youre against 5 characters (mario, bowser, kirby, peach, sheik) the problem is that the enemies all have massive attack and you have to take down at least two to be able to get rid of geno
    after so many attempts i have seen sheik spawn a few times but never killed her
    did i mention theres a time limit on this too?

    the other is dr wily where its stamina and you have to take down eight metal mega men before dr mario which is entirely too many and i havent really started on this one

    bonus: characters vs galeems fire orb attack - who wins?
    galeem has a fire orb attack and these orbs can be reflected for massive damage but only some characters can do it

    mario - nope he can only reflect a few before getting got
    link - his shield doesnt seem to stop the fire orbs for some reason despite what we saw in the intro cutscene
    fox - yes, and its really easy
    ness - you can reflect with the bat, but its not very effective. absorbing works since theyre energy projectiles, and it heals all your damage too
    zelda - youd think it work but nope
    dr mario - just see mario
    falco - seemed to work for a bit but then you still get hit after a while, maybe it does work sometimes but very unreliably if it does
    mewtwo - nope
    mr game and watch - he can bucket the orbs but he can only bucket three before he just gets hit anyway (and the bucket doesnt even do much damage)
    pit - the orbitars disappear after a while so this doesnt work
    dark pit - see pit
    lucas - same case as ness
    rob - lol no
    wolf - see fox
    villager - he can pocket one fire orb but this doesnt do much at all to help
    rosalina - her down b actually turns the orbs into her own and this can be spammed to deal damage, so yeah this does work
    mii gunner - apparently miis exist in this game and the gunners down b actually does work (still a bad character though)
    palutena - this actually does work but you have to mash b a lot otherwise it might not work
    king k rool - hes a god so his belly can also reflect projectiles but it doesnt work quite as well as palutenas and he gets hit after one or two
    isabelle - see villager

    also ice climbers is the worst character in the game as nana will often die really quick leaving you as sopo with almost no recovery and damage output
  • PalutenaPalutena Posts: 504Member ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 1
    yay im making this post in 2019 (except there are some americans out there still living in 2018 as i write this lol)

    so after trying wily and geno for a while i decided that it was too boring so i went for the final level instead

    like i mentioned earlier, the idea of a fox/zelda/palutena team sounded like a good idea

    the first part was the "climb up" part. there really isnt much to say about this at all except its quite long so messing up is a lot of time lost

    but then comes the second part

    THE BOSS RUSH (also known as ultra pain)

    in this part you have to fight the 6 previous bosses with just 3 lives
    heart containers fall every 2 bosses but these only seem to heal 150% instead of max damage
    given how much trouble the bosses gave me before it was safe to say this would be a nightmare

    at first i just chose any bosses. didnt go very far
    then i decided to go for dracula first. i used my fox against him and it turns out that in the second phase he can do his fire breath attack twice in a row, which is actually really good because they can both be reflected and it does insane damage, when getting close normally isnt safe
    at this point my fox would be dead by now and id probably be on zelda so after killing dracula i went to ganon next. zelda/palutena makes ganon 10 times easier because of teleporting and he didnt pose much threat UNLESS he does the spinning attack, then its down to luck if i dodge it or not

    by now the order id do bosses is dracula - ganon - marx - galleom - giga bowser - rathalos

    marx isnt too hard, his attacks are usually easy to dodge but you can get unlucky. one attack can be reflected

    galleom is mostly about waiting for him to attack and then doing lots of damage. if i was down to palutena at this point, i would try to counterattack as many things as possible for massive damage

    giga bowser is again about waiting for attacks and going in. fox and palutena can reflect the fire breath, but zelda cant

    ill get to rathalos later

    after some attempts i had some interesting ones

    one attempt i was already down to palutena after just dracula, at which point i beat him, then ganon, marx, and even galleom, but i messed up against giga bowser sadly
    eventually i started to survive dracula with fox, in which case i didnt go for ganon because hes bad for fox, so i chose marx instead and then my fox died
    the attempt was looking really good, zelda didnt die until giga bowser and then... rathalos

    i was doing well, reflecting the fireballs, countering all the attacks etc. only got hit twice and it didnt seem to matter but then...

    AND THEN...

    this happened

    this was the last boss. all i had to do was press the B button at the right time but this had to happen. i wasnt even at that high damage, i just died



    after that i dont think ive felt pain like this for a long while
    more hours went into failed attempts, some also getting close to rathalos
    sometimes my fox survived marx and giga bowser too
    time was running out in 2018 and i then decided to change my route a bit
    after killing dracula i want straight for rathalos and took him out second
    i messed up a few attempts after rathalos but on one attempt i somehow managed to keep reflecting and take him down with fox, with almost no damage taken at all

    i went to giga bowser, and my fox died because of carelessness, but it went on
    zelda was once again really effective against ganon
    marx fell to zelda without too much trouble
    then the final boss was galleom. i did most of the damage with zelda, then eventually i got killed, leaving me with palutena
    a few counterattacks and galleom was down to its last health. hes about to jump on me and all i have to do is press B

    but theres still one more thing left - galeem and dharkon at the same time
    this might seem terrible but remember that you get three lives
    also the two of them can hurt each other
    and the most annoying part about the boss fights (the fake characters) is nullified because now they just fight each other instead of you
    so after a few practice attempts and just under half an hour i managed to do it, and it wasnt too bad at all
    zelda died right before i could land the last hit (which would have been funny if that was the last character)

    and thats it

    the two of them were destroyed, and the ending cutscene played with the lifelight theme playing for one last time

    as the credits rolled i checked the file select to see i had finished it in the last 10 minutes of 2018

    and thats it. after 104 hours and over 600 battles finished, the journey as finall-

    "not if we have anything to say about that, AND WE DO!" - geno and dr wily

    oh... maybe some other day
    despite how powerful i might seem
    i feel like i just need a hug right now

    why did i write this here when this place is dead?
    well i felt i just had to write this journey somewhere and if needed i could link to it
  • BillaboBillabo Posts: 1,324Moderator, Friendly, Conversationalist Mod
    That was an epic tale, and I enjoyed reading it! Congratulations on getting the Kong impossible badge #(number of real imp badges +1)!
    Fire Emblem: Fates castle address
  • PalutenaPalutena Posts: 504Member ✭✭✭✭✭
    Billabo said:

    That was an epic tale, and I enjoyed reading it! Congratulations on getting the Kong impossible badge #(number of real imp badges +1)!

    (by the way, since i maxed out at 53 imp badges, this would be number 54. character #54 in smash is palutena. COINCIDENCE? yes)

    but wait its BONUS ROUND TIME!
    after some time i went back for wily and geno. i decided to use lucas here to absorb the attacks to heal. after a lot of time, the 8 mega men went down and DR MARIO APPEARED AND HE

    died when i used just one more pk starstorm

    for geno i kept using lucas. after a few tries, geno sheik appeared, and she kinda just jumped off the edge of the stage and died, bringing a super anti-climatic true ending to this journey after 105 hours

    and now

    lucas was only used for the last 2 battles as i mentioned
    dedede was only used for some fire emblem spirit
    falcon was only used for galeem fight 1
    pit was only used for botw zelda

    olimar has some weird things going on with his pikmin
    isabelle has fishing rod to easily won on walkoff spirits
    lucina is just marth echo
    daisy is just peach echo
    chrom has the best counter boost (35%) as does roy
    villager has lots of projectiles and can pocket things that would break reflectors

    after i finished, i ended up having no internet for a while, so i decided to do the obvious thing - do it again but NO ADVENTURE SKILLS EVER (this means that peach cheese was out of the question now, among other things)

    i dont want to go on too much so ill mention a few key points
    i focused more on just getting to the end rather than saving everyone this time
    and once again i got further than i first anticipated
    i took the marth path instead of sheik because marth is by far the best
    i used falcon a bit more in this journey
    for all light realm bosses i used fox when reflecting worked, and marth when countering worked
    i stayed with fox for marx, used zelda against ganon because of teleport move (also high dps against ganon) and dracula gave me trouble so i ended up using villager because i found out that his big blue energy ball is actually a projectile that is too strong to reflect, but fits nicely in villager's pocket (so why couldnt he survive the apocalypse at the beginning of the mode??)
    i still used peach final smash for one spirit, saria. this was because i could get my opponents on a moving platform and then use it to prevent them from getting off

    some battles proved to be VERY troublesome, so much so that i had to go to a last resort
    he has a strategy called chromikaze where he can up b someone who is offstage, then use it to kill yourself and your opponent at the same time. usually suicide strategies dont work but this one kills the opponent first so it does count as a win
    if you do it right you can even kill the opponent without falling which is why competitive players complain about this move a lot (just like they do about palutena nair)

    with this i was able to take out regigigas earlier, but this turned out to be useless because mewtwo is blocked by heavy wind (a massive inconvenience now because of no skill to reduce wind)

    dharkon was a problem since i found that zelda was just too slow. i used falcon for a while but to no avail. in the end i went to marth because of his counter (i didnt use chrom because lol his recovery)

    and now for the stats:
    giga bowser defeated: 7 hours in, 129/615 spaces cleared, 19/73 characters saved
    rathalos defeated: 10 hours, 156 cleared, 23 saved
    galleom defeated: 11 hours, 175 cleared, 24 saved
    galeem 1 defeated: 13 hours, 190 cleared, 26 saved
    marx defeated: 17 hours, 217 cleared, 29 saved
    ganon defeated: 21 hours, 263 cleared, 36 saved
    dracula defeated: 24 hours, 298 cleared, 43 saved
    dharkon 1 defeated: 28 hours, 299 cleared, 43 saved

    when the internet finally came back i was in the final realm. i had defeated the true master hand but hadnt got to bayonetta and the true crazy hand. so now im at something like 32 hours, 300 or so cleared and 46 saved. too lazy to check
    maybe some day ill somehow finish this too? i might follow up with a few... INTERESTING spirits
  • PalutenaPalutena Posts: 504Member ✭✭✭✭✭
    absolute final update - probably never visiting this place ever again

    it's been a long while since i last even touched the mode - it's kind of gotten boring to me
    since this site is likely going to disappear quite soon i'll copy all of the things to a text document so it doesn't get destroyed forever

    on my no skill tree run i managed to reach dharkon 2 but it is insanely hard - my best attempt reached about 30% health left

    some spirits without skill tree are borderline impossible. especially the ones with wind, and they have been made even harder since chrom's up B got nerfed in patch 2.0.0
    kapp'n is incredibly annoying and i never could beat it

    at one point i did a re-run of no spirits with skill tree to see how fast it could be done, managed to unlock all characters in about 25 hours

    i can't think of anything else to say here, but now i'm probably signing off this place forever, while preserving what needs to be. i mentioned "INTERESTING spirits" before but i can no longer remember any off the top of my head
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