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V.2.0045 is live

adam_antichristadam_antichrist Member Posts: 525 ✭✭✭
A few more cookies than the Beta, all 4%. I think about 8 cookies all up, which would sum to a 29% increase (7 x 4% + 1 x 1%)

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Comments

  • RedCookie6666RedCookie6666 Member, Flagger Posts: 2,053 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I refreshed and I didn't get the update...
    RedCookie6666 here, wishing I could post more.
    ...Eh, whatever. Very little happens on the forums these days.
  • dparejadpareja Member Posts: 453 ✭✭✭
    edited February 25
    Six more cookies than the beta, all 4%, for a total CpS gain of about 26.5%.

    Over v. 2.0042, that's 10 4% cookies and a single 1% cookie, giving (from those, not counting the heavenly upgrade that gives you a buff for unspent sugar lumps) a buff of 49.5%.

    EDIT: Probably the best change, though, is that Force the Hand of Fate can no longer start a cookie chain (which was pretty damned annoying).

    EDIT #2: Also, as a Canadian, I love the shade thrown in the flavour text for Maple cookies.
  • Asbestos_Free_CookieAsbestos_Free_Cookie Member Posts: 42 ✭✭
    There are some new heavenly upgrades. I don't have enough prestige to know much aside that one of them is called Sugar baking and it requires Stevia Caelestis. Sugar baking cost 2 mill prestige and gives you a percent boost to CPS based off of unspent sugar lumps.
  • dparejadpareja Member Posts: 453 ✭✭✭
    Those were all in the 2.0043 and 2.0044 betas. They cost 200 million, 400 million, and 600 million heavenly chips. (I can't recall all the prerequisites.) The first gives you a 1% CpS boost per unspent sugar lump, to a maximum of 100. The second lets you, once per ascension, hit a switch that will double your CpS for an hour at the cost of one sugar lump. (This was half an hour in the 2.0043 beta.) The third reduces the ripening time of sugar lumps by six seconds per Grandma, to a maximum of 50 minutes (ie 500 Grandmas). (In the 2.0043 beta, this last instead reduced maturation time by 5 seconds per Grandma, to a maximum of 41 minutes, 40 seconds, ie 500 Grandmas, while leaving ripening time untouched.)
  • Asbestos_Free_CookieAsbestos_Free_Cookie Member Posts: 42 ✭✭
    edited February 25
    dpareja said:

    Six more cookies than the beta, all 4%, for a total CpS gain of about 26.5%.

    Over v. 2.0042, that's 10 4% cookies and a single 1% cookie, giving (from those, not counting the heavenly upgrade that gives you a buff for unspent sugar lumps) a buff of 49.5%.

    EDIT: Probably the best change, though, is that Force the Hand of Fate can no longer start a cookie chain (which was pretty damned annoying).

    EDIT #2: Also, as a Canadian, I love the shade thrown in the flavour text for Maple cookies.

    Since you brought up Force the Hand of Fate. Apparently that bug I reported about golden cookies from that spell not giving golden cookie upgrades after an ascension has not been fixed.
  • dparejadpareja Member Posts: 453 ✭✭✭

    dpareja said:

    Six more cookies than the beta, all 4%, for a total CpS gain of about 26.5%.

    Over v. 2.0042, that's 10 4% cookies and a single 1% cookie, giving (from those, not counting the heavenly upgrade that gives you a buff for unspent sugar lumps) a buff of 49.5%.

    EDIT: Probably the best change, though, is that Force the Hand of Fate can no longer start a cookie chain (which was pretty damned annoying).

    EDIT #2: Also, as a Canadian, I love the shade thrown in the flavour text for Maple cookies.

    Since you brought up Force the Hand of Fate. Apparently that bug I reported about golden cookies from that spell not giving golden cookie upgrades after an ascension has not been fixed.
    And, as I believe I've said, I think that's deliberate, to make you wait a time before getting the full benefits of the golden cookie upgrades. (Unless you want to burn some of your permanent upgrade slots on them, anyway.)
  • Asbestos_Free_CookieAsbestos_Free_Cookie Member Posts: 42 ✭✭
    Anyone know if that grandma reducing the sugar lump time heavenly upgrade helps if the game is closed?
  • dparejadpareja Member Posts: 453 ✭✭✭

    Anyone know if that grandma reducing the sugar lump time heavenly upgrade helps if the game is closed?

    I checked this.

    I have every Heavenly upgrade and well over 500 Grandmas.

    I set, for my Pantheon, Rigidel/Mokalsium/Holobore. Rigidel is active with 7,700 buildings. (I'm more concerned about harvesting sugar lumps than CpS gain right now.)

    At 7:34 PM, I checked my growing lump and it had five hours to maturity. I saved and closed at this point.

    If everything works, my lump should drop at 2:44 AM.

    I checked my game again at 12:04 PM. The lump had dropped, and there was 10 hours, 40 minutes to go to maturity for my next lump.

    This means that the lump had dropped 8 hours, 20 minutes ago, that is, at 3:44 AM.

    I conclude, then, that Sugar aging process works while the game is closed, but, as has been noted previously, Rigidel still does not.
  • Asbestos_Free_CookieAsbestos_Free_Cookie Member Posts: 42 ✭✭
    edited March 10
    Does Sugar baking work when the game is closed (the 1% bonus for unspent sugar lumps)? What about Sugar Craving (the once per game spend a sugar lump for a 1 hour x 2 bonus)?
    (I have Twin Gates of Transcendence and most of the things that require it).
  • dparejadpareja Member Posts: 453 ✭✭✭
    99.99999999999% sure that Sugar baking works when the game is closed, just like Heavenly cookies and Wrinkly cookies work.

    No clue about Sugar craving; I don't spend my sugar lumps on temporary boosts.
  • bob_32_116bob_32_116 Member Posts: 770 ✭✭✭
    dpareja said:


    EDIT: Probably the best change, though, is that Force the Hand of Fate can no longer start a cookie chain (which was pretty damned annoying).

    It can still start a cookie storm though, as I just discovered to my annoyance. that's worse.
  • dparejadpareja Member Posts: 453 ✭✭✭

    dpareja said:


    EDIT: Probably the best change, though, is that Force the Hand of Fate can no longer start a cookie chain (which was pretty damned annoying).

    It can still start a cookie storm though, as I just discovered to my annoyance. that's worse.
    Why do you think that's worse? You can save-scum past them if you like, or early on they're useful for getting Easter eggs.
  • bob_32_116bob_32_116 Member Posts: 770 ✭✭✭
    edited March 19
    dpareja said:

    dpareja said:


    EDIT: Probably the best change, though, is that Force the Hand of Fate can no longer start a cookie chain (which was pretty damned annoying).

    It can still start a cookie storm though, as I just discovered to my annoyance. that's worse.
    Why do you think that's worse? You can save-scum past them if you like, or early on they're useful for getting Easter eggs.
    Oh it's just that I groan when I get a Cookie Storm; I feel as though I have to click some of the cookies so as not to waste it, but several times when I clicked rapidly the processor seems unable to keep up with the game, causing the game to freeze and forcing me to restart the browser. hence I just click slowly and steadily, waiting to see the burst from each one before clicking the next one. and it's almost a relief when the storm finishes.

  • dparejadpareja Member Posts: 453 ✭✭✭

    dpareja said:

    dpareja said:


    EDIT: Probably the best change, though, is that Force the Hand of Fate can no longer start a cookie chain (which was pretty damned annoying).

    It can still start a cookie storm though, as I just discovered to my annoyance. that's worse.
    Why do you think that's worse? You can save-scum past them if you like, or early on they're useful for getting Easter eggs.
    Oh it's just that I groan when I get a Cookie Storm; I feel as though I have to click some of the cookies so as not to waste it, but several times when I clicked rapidly the processor seems unable to keep up with the game, causing the game to freeze and forcing me to restart the browser. hence I just click slowly and steadily, waiting to see the burst from each one before clicking the next one. and it's almost a relief when the storm finishes.

    Ah, fair enough. I typically don't get that when I get a cookie storm.
  • bob_32_116bob_32_116 Member Posts: 770 ✭✭✭
    It seems to me that the "far endgame", which I define as the point at which you can afford 400 or more of every building, is now just a matter of whenever Spontaneous Edifice is available, selling the 400th Chancemaker and getting it back with SE - and occasionally buying other buildings when the mood takes you, though at this point the extra production from other buildings is insignificant compared to the effective production from SE. Would others agree?

    If so, that means Earth Shatterer should be installed as soon as soon as the 400-Chancemaker point is reached. The extra cookies from selling it at 85% rather than 50% far outweigh the loss in CpS from replacing breath of milk by Earth Shatterer. There may come a point in the distant future when you have 400 Chancemakers and a very large number of everything else, making it worth bringing in Breath of milk again, but I suspect that the number of buildings required is more than I am likely to ever obtain in the current version of the game.
  • adam_antichristadam_antichrist Member Posts: 525 ✭✭✭

    The extra cookies from selling it at 85% rather than 50% far outweigh the loss in CpS from replacing breath of milk by Earth Shatterer.

    Wouldn't that depend on how many times per day you us SE? Breath of Milk works 24/7. You can use SE about once per hour, and then you have the chance that it will backfire which further reduces the time it is usable. At what point does one outweigh the other?


  • bob_32_116bob_32_116 Member Posts: 770 ✭✭✭

    The extra cookies from selling it at 85% rather than 50% far outweigh the loss in CpS from replacing breath of milk by Earth Shatterer.

    Wouldn't that depend on how many times per day you us SE? Breath of Milk works 24/7. You can use SE about once per hour, and then you have the chance that it will backfire which further reduces the time it is usable. At what point does one outweigh the other?

    Yes of course. It would depend on how much you watch the screen, and none of us watch it 24/7; we all have to sleep sometime. However my rough calculations lead me to think that even someone like myself, who uses SE maybe only eight times in a day, with one or maybe two backfirings, is still better off using SE.

    When i have an idle moment, I'll do a more methodical calculation.
  • bob_32_116bob_32_116 Member Posts: 770 ✭✭✭
    edited March 25
    OK, I did some calculations.

    With Radiant appetite and breath of milk installed, current CpS is 18.3 decillion.
    If I had 400 Chancemakers, cost of the 400th one is 47.5 duodecillion. the resale value is 50% of this, or 23.7 duo.
    Assuming I invoke Spontaneous Edifice 8 times a day, and with a backfire rate of 15%, this represents a CpS of 23.7 * 8 * 0.85/86400 = 1.87 undecillion. this is about 100 times the CpS from every other source.

    If I now replace Breath of milk by Earth Shatterer, my current CpS drops to 12.6dec. However resale value is now 85% instead of 50%, giving a CpS boost of 3.18 undecillion.

    The difference in combined CpS is about 1.3 undecillion, or 70 times my current production. It's no contest. one can argue about how many times I can cast the spell per day, using save-scum to eliminate backfires, etc., but the extra boost from SE easily dwarfs the rest of the CpS, and means Earth Shatterer should be installed as soon as 400 chancemakers are obtained.

    For BoM to be the better option, my normal production would have to be 70 times what it is, which means 70 times as many buildings (not possible) or extra production upgrades giving a combined multiplicative value of 70+ (which may happen in some future incarnation of the game I suppose). Or, if I played for a very long time, getting a boost from prestige points of 70 times what I get now, which would require getting 343,000 times as many cookies. I think there is a message here.
  • adam_antichristadam_antichrist Member Posts: 525 ✭✭✭
    I'm assuming you mean prestige boost, not CPS, but even once per day we are still better off with earth shatterer. At what point does the prestige boost become insignificant and we are better off going back to BOM?

  • JezDavisJezDavis Member Posts: 195 ✭✭
    edited April 3

    I'm assuming you mean prestige boost, not CPS, but even once per day we are still better off with earth shatterer. At what point does the prestige boost become insignificant and we are better off going back to BOM?


    That's an ongoing enquiry I'm running. I've got Earthshatterer slotted and at present my prestige is at 34.2Bn + 2Bn from this ascension. Selling a Chancemaker nets me 10.4M, reducing every time. I reckon by the time I get to c.50Bn the returns in terms of prestige will be negligible and it'll be time to start focusing on 450 Chancemakers.
    Post edited by JezDavis on
  • bob_32_116bob_32_116 Member Posts: 770 ✭✭✭

    I'm assuming you mean prestige boost, not CPS

    No I didn't, I meant CpS. Not CpS as in cookies produced continually by buildings, but the CpS equivalent of repeatedly selling a Chancemaker and getting it back with Spontaneous Edifice. That's extra cookies that go into the bank and add to you all-time total, so as far as I'm concerned it's "production".

    even once per day we are still better off with earth shatterer. At what point does the prestige boost become insignificant and we are better off going back to BOM?

    I thought I already answered this, or gave what I believed to be the answer. See the last paragraph of my preceding post. The break-even point will be earlier or later according to how often you cast SE, but for me it's definitely a LONG time in the future.

  • bob_32_116bob_32_116 Member Posts: 770 ✭✭✭
    Now that I am approaching the point of having 400 chancemakers, I am finding the limiting factor is the number of cookies-at-bank, which needs to be at leasts half the cost of the next chancemaker - and of course this quantity increases by 15% each new chancemaker.

    Accordingly I have been selling batches of other buildings in order to boost the bank. Of course I am making sure not to go under 400 of any other building. I have not done the maths, but I am almost certain that the small decrease in CpS is more than compensated for by the prospect of reaching 400 chancemakers sooner, because once that happens I'll be rolling in cookies.

    It's now occurred to me that it would have been better not to take any other buildings over 400 in the first place, but to hoard cookies until I could get the 400th chancemaker, rather than selling the buildings at a loss. That's probably what I'll do in future runs.
  • adam_antichristadam_antichrist Member Posts: 525 ✭✭✭
    Just sell your most recent chancemanker. It is worth more than other buildings and you get it back straight away.

  • bob_32_116bob_32_116 Member Posts: 770 ✭✭✭

    Just sell your most recent chancemanker. It is worth more than other buildings and you get it back straight away.

    You are probably right. Not because it's the most expensive building, but because it's currently the one for which the time cost (cost divided by increase in production per building) is greatest. Another way of saying that is that if I need to acquire a certain number of cookies to cast Spontaneous Edifice, getting those cookies by selling one or more chancemakers will not decrease my CpS as much as selling the required number of other buildings.
  • bob_32_116bob_32_116 Member Posts: 770 ✭✭✭
    edited April 5
    Spontaneous Edifice is such a game-changer that it almost merits having its own thread. Just to belabour the point a bit more, I have just reached the point in my game where after selling a chancemaker the cookies-at-bank exceeds the number of cookies baked this run, meaning that the proceeds from the sales now contribute to cookies-baked-all-time and therefore I include this in my calculation of CpS. When I do this, my index (current CpS/average CpS), which was hovering around 1.2, jumped by a factor of about 10, to now be 10.4. Replacing Breath of milk by earth Shatterer has decreased this only slightly, to 10.1.

    If I ascended right now, my prestige CpS boost on ascension would be only 1.158. Clearly ascending now would be a very bad strategy, and in fact this run, which at 25 days is already one of the longer ones, is destined to last a good deal longer.

    For someone like myself who plays mostly passively, the game has become a matter of maximising the benefit from SE by getting to the point of 400 of everything except chancemakers as quickly as possible in the run, then when chancemakers hit 400 start buying other buildings again but not worrying too much about buying strategy, as most of the production will be coming from SE.
  • JezDavisJezDavis Member Posts: 195 ✭✭
    What's the Prestige boost you're getting from each sale of the 400th CM?
  • bob_32_116bob_32_116 Member Posts: 770 ✭✭✭
    edited April 5
    JezDavis said:

    What's the Prestige boost you're getting from each sale of the 400th CM?

    I'll let you know when I get to that point. Currently only on 394 chancemakers in the live version, and 396 in the beta.

    I hardly even look at the "Additional prestige this run" counter any more because it has become almost meaningless. It calculates prestige based only on the total cookies baked so far, and does not count the massive boost that will come at the end of the run when I sell everything, not to mention the extra boost from Choc Egg.

    For example, in my current live game the counter says I have about 247 million extra prestige points so for this run. However I calculate that if i were to ascend right now, selling all buildings and cashing in Choc Egg, I would in fact get a boost of 1.12 billion, taking my prestige from 6.6 billion to 7.7 billion.

    As they used to say in ads for a supermarket chain in this country, "It's the total of the take that counts."
    Post edited by bob_32_116 on
  • bob_32_116bob_32_116 Member Posts: 770 ✭✭✭
    edited April 5
    Further thoughts on SE:

    I have allowed myself to get into a pattern of replacing Mokalsium by Skruuia in the diamond slot of the Pantheon prior to bursting the wrinklers, then returning Mokalsium to the slot. This has meant that my wrinkler-popping has largely been governed by how long it takes the Worship swaps to go from 1 back up to 3.

    Now that building production (and therefore also wrinkler boost) is only a fraction, about 10%, of total CpS, that's not a major consideration any more. I mean, I will still use Skruuia when I can, to get the maximum benefit, but it's no longer such a big deal if I want to pop some wrinklers to free up some cookies and I don't have Worship swaps in hand to allow me to use Skruuia.
  • adam_antichristadam_antichrist Member Posts: 525 ✭✭✭
    JezDavis said:

    What's the Prestige boost you're getting from each sale of the 400th CM?

    It depends on how much prestige you have to begin with, since it is linked to cookies baked. The first time I was doing it I was getting 100million every time I sold a chancemaker. It got down to 50M and I ascended. As long as your CBTA is close to cookies in bank you get the prestige kick. With the new update mine has gone up again on the beta to over 50M. Currently on the live version getting about 40M. So it's well worth it and will continue to be worth it for a while.

  • MaddieMaddie Member Posts: 168 ✭✭
    I've got 17+ billion Prestige Points. Selling a Chancemaker with Shatterer in the aura gives me 35 DC cookies and about 37 Million PP.
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